Talk:Charlus Potter's son
Does this article refer to James Potter? I don't believe that this article refers to James, because wouldn't he have thus been burned off the Black Family tapestry for not marrying a pure blood? Unless, of course, the marriage took place after the "burnings" stopped. However, wouldn't James have been burned off at the same time Sirius was? Just my views on the subject. 02:43, 24 July 2009 (UTC) :Personally, I think it's unlikely that Charlus and Dorea were James' parents, because if this were the case, then Dorea would've been disowned for taking in the runaway Sirius (Alphard was disowned for simply leaving Sirius money in his will). Sirius tells Harry in Order of the Phoenix, Ch. 6, that one of the reasons he left home at 16 was because he hated his parents' "pure-blood mania." James' parents were kind of sending the message that they supported Sirius' viewpoints when they took him in and treated him as a second son. :Also, when James meets Sirius for the first time in Deathly Hallows, Ch. 33, he's surprised to learn that Sirius' "whole family" has been in Slytherin. If James' mother had been born a Black, then he probably would've been aware of the Black family's traditional House prior to meeting Sirius. ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 11:30, 26 July 2009 (UTC) Yea, some of those points also occurred to me after I posted my initial statement. Do you think it's possible that the Black Family didn't know where Sirius moved to? This probably wouldn't change anything, and my personal opinion is that James Potter would've been burned off for being in Gryffindor anyways, but it would've at least spared Dorea from being burned off. And I don't know if you know this, or if there is even a known answer, but do you know if magical family trees automatically add people to the tapestry/surface, or does the owner have to do it manually? Unrelated, I know, but just curious.--Immobulus 01:24, 29 July 2009 (UTC) :While I think there is still considerable doubt as to whether Dorea and Charlus were James's parents, I don't think there's enough evidence to write off the possibility entirely. If the family tree goes back to the Middle Ages (as stated in Chapter 6 of Order of the Phoenix), then we have only a small fraction of it. Furthermore, there are a lot of gaps in what we do have. :No name or dates of birth or death are offered for Charlus and Dorea's son -- for all we know, he could have been burned off. I doubt he would have been burned off for being in Gryffindor (if he was James, that is), though. Sirius was burned off only after he ran away from home at age sixteen, not when he was sorted at age eleven. Besides, if a Black married into another family that wasn't traditionally sorted into Slytherin (and the Potters seem to be one of them), then it would hardly make sense to burn them off for following the tradition of their family. :We also don't get names or dates for the children of Belvina Black and Herbert Burke or for the children of Callidora Black and Harfang Longbottom. Essentially, either the Blacks didn't show much detail on their family tree for their distaff relatives (i.e. they didn't show generations of people with a different family name, even if they were their relatives) or we weren't provided with the details. For instance, Callidora and Harfang could be Neville Longbottom's ancestors, and Neville and his parents would clearly qualify as "blood traitors" too, but we have no idea whether they are even on the tree, let alone burned off it. :As for Dorea and Charlus not being burned off the tapestry, as Immobulus pointed out, it's possible that Walburga Black didn't know where Sirius ran off to. I highly doubt that he was in touch with any of his family members (aside from Andromeda) after that. He also moved out of the Potters' house within a year and got his own place. :Also, all of this was occurring during the height of the First Wizarding War. Sirius's own comments on that war indicate that there was widespread fear and mistrust, because no one knew who Voldemort's supporters were. If you were on either side, you would probably be secretive -- especially from family members whom you suspect are on the opposite side. If Dorea was James's mother, the last thing she would want to do is inform her Muggle-hating, Death Eater-connected relatives that she is taking in their "blood traitor" son and her own child is marrying a Muggle-born (not to mention that they're all members of the Order of the Phoenix as well). Oread (talk) 16:49, 2 August 2009 (UTC) ::I tend to think that Walburga had to have learned where Sirius went somehow. Sirius, at 16, would've still been attending Hogwarts when he left home, so Regulus could have spied on him when he was talking to James and told Walburga what he heard. All it would've taken for Sirius to give away where he was staying/had stayed was one comment like "I really like your mom's cooking" or "I liked playing Quidditch with your dad." But I can accept wartime secrecy as an explanation for why Walburga didn't find out about where Sirius had stayed and disown Dorea. ::What I can't understand is why James didn't know about the Black family's traditional House until he met Sirius. If Dorea was his mother, wouldn't she have told him about her family, or had she disconnected from them to the extent that she wouldn't even talk about them? Plus, Sirius told Harry that "any time the family produced someone halfway decent they were disowned" (OotP6), then mentioned Tonks and Andromeda as examples. By Sirius' own account, he was treated kindly by James' mother, so if she'd been related to him, wouldn't he have pointed her out to Harry as another decent member of the Black family? Even if she hadn't been disowned, I imagine Sirius still would've told Harry, just to give him a better idea of the kind of person his grandmother was. ::Personally, I think that Charlus and Dorea may have been James' uncle and aunt (Charlus being James' father's brother), and that in order for Dorea to have avoided being disowned, the couple must have either toed the Black family line on blood purity or kept any dissenting views they held to themselves. Charlus being completely estranged from James' father would also explain why James didn't know about the Black family until he met Sirius. ::Still, this is all speculation on my part, and nothing is definitively known. Charlus and Dorea may very well be James' parents. JKR was certainly right when she wrote "there are many stories between these lines" on the Black family tree. I hope she reveals more about Dorea and Charlus in "The Scottish Book." ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 08:09, 14 August 2009 (UTC) If Charlus's son were James ...then wouldn't Harry have noticed his own name on the tapestry? I do not know about most people, but if there are a bunch of names with mine included, my name usually jumps out at me first. It is a subconcious thing. How could Harry not recognize or mention his own name on the tapestry? It is unlikely, seeing as he easily identified Draco Malfoy's name on the list. I doubt James is Charlus's son, but rather his nephew. Like the whole Ignatius Prewett thing. 03:50, April 22, 2010 (UTC) Harry wouldn't have been on the tree; if Charlus's son was James - which is the most likely option - then he'd have been blasted off of the tree for marrying a Muggleborn; thus, his descendants (Harry and Harry's children) would not appear on it. HarryPotterRules1 (talk) 22:56, May 28, 2013 (UTC) This is the Harry who still doesn't know all of his classmates' names after 5 years, I doubt he'd notice. Also, he's been trained by the Dursleys not to ask about his family so he probably didn't want to ask. But I think Jo made an error in putting Dorea and Charlus in that generation. She's said in interviews that James's parents were "old, even by Wizarding standards" when they had him, so I think they were meant to be up a generation which would make more sense. Consdiering that Callidora Black wasn't disowned for marrying Harfang Longbottom and Lucretia Black wasn't disowned for marrying Ignatuius Prewett (persumably uncle to Molly as they appear not to have children) then the Potters might also not have been outward blood traitors. The only family that gets that treatment seems to be the Weasleys. - LupineMoon (talk) 23:10, March 4, 2015 (UTC) He could have been a death eater I think that Charlus and Dorea not being dissowned and all of that tells us that they were not James' parents. I also think that if Charlus potter was James' uncle then it would either make sense that Charlus Potter's son died before, most likely by death eaters or have been a death eater himself. He could be like barty crouches son. He could have been a death eater and killed by aurors. If he was a death eater then that would answer why Voldemort tried to recruit James. If he was not James's first cousin then he could be on the slytherin side of the Potters. He would be part of the black family and it would be more likely of him becoming a death eater. He is not mentioned among the death eaters partly because we don't know who he is but he could have been a minor one.Abrawak 20:23, March 25, 2010 (UTC) He's not James New information from Pottermore: James Potter's parents were Fleamont and Euphemia Potter, this man isn't definitely James.Firestorm 1999 (talk) 13:50, September 22, 2015 (UTC) Potter Line Linfred of Stinchcombe had seven children - one or more which was male and one or more which made Linfred's nickname their surname since Linfred was known as "the Potter" in their lifetime and adopting the name would show their relationship to Linfred. Charlus Potter could have descended from a different son of Linfred's. Since we are all ultimately related somehow, there must be a distance from which the blood is considered too dilute to offer protection. Linfred would, by necessity, have had a biological mother and father, though whether he had siblings is unknown. If he did have siblings, they were not Potters since he was the first of that line. It is also not known whether or not his biological parents lied in Stinchcombe or whether he moved there after he left home. The designation Linfred of Stinchcombe would differentiate him, before there were surnames, from Linfreds living elsewhere. A stinch is a sandpiper. Peverell is French for piper. (Vaudree (talk) 18:14, October 24, 2015 (UTC)) Burnings Who is burned off the tapestry depends on who does the burning. I would presume that, since the tapestry is part of the house, that it is the owner of the house who did the burning and then the person who inherited the house from them. I don't know how one gets on the tapestry, but it does seem that once one's name is blasted off, one's subsequent descendants don't show up. Would have liked Hermione to have prepared the burned holes - especially for the squibs. JKR said some place that many muggle-borns had squib ancestors - so, it is possible that even Hermione is related to the Blacks, though unlikely. (Vaudree (talk) 18:14, October 24, 2015 (UTC)) Hermione even is related to the Blacks, through Ron, who is related to them through his grandmother, Cedrella Weasley (neé Black). Just wanted to point this out. Muggle-borns are witches and wizards that always had a Squib ancestor, as the magic simply resurfaced a few generations later, or so I took it, not just that many Muggle-borns had Squibs somewhere in their ancestry. AzuraKitsune (talk) 15:45, October 29, 2018 (UTC) What if he isn't dead? Well, basically, it was Lily who made the sacrficial protection that kept Harry safe for 17 years, not James, and Dumblebore said something about Harry's mothers' blood and not Harry's fathers' blood, and as Dumbledore chose to leave Harry with the Dursleys for that reason, it might be possible for him to still be alive, as if Lily evoked the magic to protect Harry, it had to run through her blood, and I'm pretty sure, as a Muggle-born, that Lily was not closely related to Charlus Potter's son enough for the magic to work, it had to be Petunia, since she was her sister. It just occured to me, and since even McGonagall, or anyone else who believes Harry had no living relatives, do not know the entire Black Family Tree of by heart, it's most likely safe to assume that there's a chance Charlus's son is alive. This, however, is pure speculation, with no firm ground of proof, if I say so myself, but it is interesting to consider. AzuraKitsune (talk) 15:39, October 29, 2018 (UTC)